Tara (00:54):
Welcome to episode 20 of the Art of Estate Planning podcast. I'm thrilled that you have joined me now. Usually it's Carrie Payne and I are having a chat. Carrie's not here. And instead, I am joined by my very dear and very inspiring friend Caralee.
Caralee (01:16):
Hi, how are you?
Tara (01:17):
I'm so well, and I'm thrilled that you've made time to join me. So...
Caralee (01:22):
I thought you'd never ask. I can't believe you did 20 podcasts without me already.
Tara (01:28):
Oh, well, I had to find time when you were actually in the country for starters. Yeah, if you follow Caralee, you will know. She is pretty much jet setting. How many times did you go overseas in 2024?
Caralee (01:39):
I haven't counted. I haven't counted, but quite a few.
Tara (01:43):
You would need fingers and toes, right?
Caralee (01:45):
Yes. I've already got a fairly booked out calendar for 2025, which is exciting.
Tara (01:49):
I love that. I am stuck at home, well, not stuck, but I'm in my era of staying home with my little ones because travelling with them is just parenting in a different location that's harder. So I am living vicariously through you and all your travel on social. I love it.
Caralee (02:08):
Yeah, well, I've done my hard yards with the little kids and definitely enjoying that next era of a bit more friends.
Tara (02:16):
You deserve every minute of it, honestly. Now if you're listening and you don't actually know who Caralee is, well firstly you're probably living under a rock, but I will introduce her formally for you. So Caralee is the founder of Scalable Law. She is the principal of Collective Family Law Group and also the founder of the Law Biz Conference, which we all went to in 2024 and had the best time. I've already got my ticket for 2025. Have I missed anything? Caralee, what else are you doing?
Caralee (02:50):
No, that sounds about right. Yeah, those are my main things that I'm up to.
Tara (02:55):
Oh yeah, just running a law firm and Scalable law and Australia's funnest to say business conference for lawyers. I've actually brought you on here to talk to our listeners about Scalable Law because I just love what you're doing and I really don't want to gate keep, and I think this time of year it's absolutely perfect for people who are starting to think about what does their year ahead look like. And Carrie and I are so passionate about estate planning, lawyers leading joyful and abundant lives and loving their career in estate planning. And Caralee, you do a lot of work in that space, really helping lawyers go on a transformative journey to having their law firm work for them. So tell us a little bit about what is scalable law?
Caralee (03:47):
Well, I guess first I'll tell you a little bit about my journey as a law firm owner. So I started my practise in 2012 and most law firm owners fumbled my way through trying to work out how to grow this thing. And we all start out with these intentions of it's going to be great, I'm going to have more freedom and I'm going to replace my salary and I'll have more flexibility being my own boss. But then most people, you find out that you are probably the worst boss that you've ever had because you have to be accountable to yourself and you end up working crazy hours and you might have some flexibility in the day, but then you work till 10 o'clock at night or are opening emails on the weekend and you don't go on holiday because you can't leave the firm because this firm's like a newborn baby initially for the first few years.
(04:41):
And so fumbling through how to get that firm from that newborn baby stage into more like, and Tara and I were talking about it in our own families. She's at home with small kids and I've got more independent older kids now, so I've got a bit more freedom. So how do you do that in your law firm? Take it from that sort of infancy stage where it's really reliant on you to a law firm that's operating a lot by itself and it's not relying on you as a law firm owner. And I had a few friends, my firm is based in Southeast Queensland. I had a few friends in law practises, but I would go and have lunch with them. And I feel like law firm owners are quite secretive or lawyers are quite secretive and that's awesome about your group. And also mine is that we've both been able to create an openness which only helps everybody.
(05:34):
Whereas when I had my practise on my own, it just felt like a hard slog on my own. I was a sole practitioner. It was only me relying on myself to make decisions. And then once my firm started going really well and I grew my team to about a team of 10 or so, and it really started to, I'd gone through the challenges and I really started to create a firm that didn't rely on me. Things were loosening up, profit was great. I then thought what next? And that's when I started thinking and dreaming about helping other law firm owners to do that in their own practises. So that's sort of when scalable law was born, which was at the end of 2020.
Tara (06:18):
Yeah, it's really impressive, Caralee. And I mean, just so people understand how you are walking the talk, tell us about Collective Family Law Group. You have an active law firm that you are the principal of?
Caralee (06:35):
Yes. The side team, yes. A very active law firm. Yeah, it's very busy and the firm has an amazing team of people, which is one of the hardest challenges when it comes to running a law firm is how do you find and maintain an incredible team because people are our biggest assets and law firms and that's one of the areas that all the lawyers that I'm working with struggle with the most. And so howling them to build that team out is fun but challenging. So my law firm has a team of 15. We're based in Brisbane and the Gold Coast. We practise only family law and the firm is completely systemized, not just by tech, but by processes and systems so that everyone in the firm knows exactly what they're doing and how to run their roles to their best ability without coming to me to ask questions. And so this is some of the things that I help law firm owners do in their own practises is how do you get to go away on holiday for six weeks without worrying about your firm crumbling around you?
(07:39):
And so I work about five hours a week in my law practise that's inconsistent. Some weeks I might dip in 10 hours a week and other weeks I'll do nothing in the practise except a couple of meetings. And it's really something that does not cause me any stress. I make a great profit from the firm and I have a wonderful team that's running it, but that hasn't happened by itself. That's happened very intentionally. So yeah, that's my firm and I really spend most of my time in scalable law because that's my passion and I really love seeing those transformations in other people's lives going from that overwhelmed, burnt out, stressed to, I've got this and I can actually see how this firm can really give me the lifestyle that I intended in the first place.
Tara (08:32):
Yeah, it's really impressive to watch Caralee and we have quite a few members of our TT Precedents Club who are part of Scalable Law and I've been watching their transformations over the last few years and it's been incredible. One member in particular who runs a soul practise in a rural area that's very busy, I remember her going from startup through to great, we are so booked and busy and making a lot of money, but everything relies on me to watching her last year take I think six weeks off and go to Paris and Europe and then finish it off.
Caralee (09:13):
Yes. So she's been in the scalable business lounge. And the thing with someone like her is that she shows up. So she's been in the Scalable business lounge for about three years and she's a great student of learning business and I'm sure she's also someone who shows up really nicely in the TT club as well. And because of that, she gets amazing results. So she puts the work in and she's actually stepping up into the next programme we have, which is for firms that have a team. And that's because she wants even more freedom to be able to go away and do run her business without having to be in the business all the time, even more.
Tara (09:56):
So at Scalable law, what exactly do you do? I see you coaching law firm owners on different issues, helping them scale set up systems and processes to maximise profit. What's going on in the scalable lounge?
Caralee (10:09):
Well, it depends where people are at because different law firm owners at and different need different sorts of support. So for law firm owners that are running a firm, they might be in their first few years and are sort of thinking, I'm over being a solo, I really want to start growing a team for those law firm owners, what we really help do is get more work in the door. And so often I find with that group of people, the stress is more about cashflow. How can I afford to start building a team out? Can I afford it? What if I don't keep making that same money again? And just the inconsistency of work because often they're relying on a handful of referrals and they haven't yet harnessed the incredible other tools that we have before us really creating a strong brand authority in the estate planning space and also getting out there with the organic marketing.
(11:09):
So there's a whole lot of stuff that they could be implementing, which is essentially free to do and getting a whole lot of work more consistently than what a handful of referrals will give you and being really intentional about that. So I teach them how to really step out and implement those strategies and create really a well-oiled marketing blueprint and machine that's inserted into their business. And also things like should they get an agency? Am I going to waste my money? How do I know if I spend money on that? Is it going to be a good spend or a good investment? So I teach them all of that and very openly share all of the tens of thousands of dollars that I've wasted on making poor and so that they can avoid doing that and really creating also a data-driven law firm so that you're relying on actual figures and numbers rather than relying on just guesswork.
(12:06):
So that's the first group of people that I help. So it's really about getting to your first million dollar turnover, if that's the goal, and hiring your first one or two team members to help you get there. And then the second group of people is when they've got a business that's already bringing in lots of clients and they've already started growing a team, they've got a few solicitors, but their business is messy and it's costing them a lot of time that in the business they're now not only running files, running a team and operations of a business, but they're also often doing all the other things as well the same as when they're a sole practitioner, but the work just gets heavier and heavier because they're adding more and more people. And what I find, and I was definitely one of these law firms, is that at a certain point it taps out and you can't keep doing the same thing.
(13:01):
You just keep getting the same result, which is burning staff through and feeling burnt out because you're looking after so many team members and everything seems like hard work and you're putting out fires all the time. So with those people, we really help them to systemize it. And the goal here is not only to create profit, but also to reduce their working hours. So sometimes they're working 60, 70, 80 hours a week, and my goal there is to get them to reduce down to 25 hours a week, which we've successfully been able to do in multiple firms. So over the time I've run that programme, that's an awesome, the results are amazing.
Tara (13:40):
Yeah, that's a phenomenal transformation. And yeah, I think there be plenty of people listening going that's just not, I can't even see how that's possible, but the proof's in the pudding isn't it?
Caralee (13:52):
It is possible. And I think it's really, we need to shift away from this whole culture. And I know for you, Tara, when you finished up working for a firm, you were burnt out and there was this culture of I've just got to work my butt off. And it's like you're not being a real lawyer unless you are absolutely exhausted and burnt out. And I just think that culture, we need to say goodbye to that. That is absolutely not the truth at all. And the opportunity of being a law firm owner is that you can work less for more. You've just got to know exactly how to work smarter and not harder. And we can say it work smarter and not harder, but how? And if you dunno how, that's really what I teach people how to do is really get your business so that you are not working for it. You are not, its slave, but it's working for you in the way you want it to work for you.
Tara (14:50):
Yeah. I mean, what I love about your beautiful community that you've built, not only do you give people all the resources off the shelf, just plug and play answers, but you've got so many people who are already in there on different ways through this journey who are proof that it works and inspiration about that they've made these changes. You can make them too. I just love it as an outsider looking in, I'm not in the scalable law. I'm not running a law firm per se, from the outside looking in, seeing our TT precedents club members who I can tell when they've joined the scalable law group because I can just see all these changes being made and it's absolutely incredible.
Caralee (15:42):
And I think so much of it as just we're being trained as lawyers, not necessarily as business people. And so it's a learning curve when you start your own business and there's so much support for lawyers when it comes to the technical side of being a lawyer, but often lawyers who start their own firms are already great at that that're already excellent lawyers. You go off and get your CPD points every year for your practise area, but you're not actually upleveling in other areas of being a business owner. And there's a lot of skill and information and things to learn as a business owner, which is a separate from being a lawyer in your practise.
Tara (16:25):
Absolutely. Where did we ever learn any of that? And I guess I just want to be completely frank here. If you are listening to this and you are sitting there and saying, okay, I've had my break over the holidays and hopefully you have had a really good break and you filled your car up and you're excited for the year ahead, I can imagine you might be sitting there going, okay, I know I've got to do a whole bunch of things in the business and do I throw money at SEO? Do I do Facebook ads? Do I level up the business? Do I have to start hiring someone and I've got nothing, no protocols, nothing, all these systems. And it can probably feel very overwhelming about where do you start, what is worth investing in and what's not? And I guess I would just say to you if that's resonating, talk to Caralee, have a look at her offerings at Scalable law because she just has the complete blueprint of what to work on first. And it's not just information, right? Caralee, there's templates, there's plug and play resources.
Caralee (17:37):
And it's fed up too because I'm a great learner and we're all great at learning, but it's no good learning and just storing information because that doesn't actually move us forward if can relate to being a reader and you read all these business books, but then you think that's great, but then you still know really further ahead in terms of implementation. So the whole programme is set up that you learn something but you implement it. You don't just keep learning and learning and creating a bank full of knowledge. It's actually practical things to put in place so that you can move the business forward. And I think when it comes to, say marketing for example, so if you're a solo who wants to maybe get to your first $20,0000-30,000 months so that you can start thinking about hiring someone in your practise, so who do you hire first of all, when do you hire them?
(18:34):
How do I get my months happening so that I can actually afford it and sleep well at night knowing that I've got plenty of cashflow with someone like that? We'd give you a 90 day plan so you know exactly what to do. I've been in programmes myself before, not for the law firm, but for just different programmes that I've done in the past, both Tara and I've done different programmes to learn how to create an online business, for example. And when you go into a programme and it's all just a smattering of information and it's not set out where it's step by step, you just get lost.
(19:16):
And so I've created something very intentional where this is step one, this is step two because otherwise overwhelm hits and then we don't know what to do and we just stay stagnant because we're too scared to misstep. And I think with lawyers, we are naturally are perfectionists, we're naturally risk adverse, so we've kind of got to fight those tendencies as well. And the thing is, is that you are going to make some mistakes running your business, but nothing's fatal. And having a hand and support where the right next steps really does help. And if you can get somewhere and three years versus six years, why wouldn't you?
Tara (20:01):
Yeah, absolutely. And you get there so much more smoothly, right? Work 25 hours a week making more money, why not?
Caralee (20:11):
Yeah, exactly. And that's exactly the same as what you offer, right? It's really that's support so that you don't have to muddle through something and make the mistakes yourself. You've got someone who's guiding you who's already been there and done that. And now not only for me and for you too, Tara, not only have you been there and done that for yourself, I've now helped 250 firms since 2020. And so I know through them implementing that everything works because it's only, I haven't only implemented in my own firm, but I've helped others do the same. And then I can see their amazing results. And I also see, because I get to have this overall look of what everyone's doing, I can also see people who do really well in their firms. They are implementers and they really get stuck in and just get the work done and it makes a huge difference.
Tara (21:10):
Yeah. Caralee, I want to ask you or pick your brain a little bit for everybody because you have a lot of members who run estate planning firms, whether they're socialised just in estate planning or they do a bit of estate planning with other practise areas. And you mentioned before we started recording, you can see who's not charging enough and who needs to put their prices up. And I just think the benefit of having someone like you in their corner is so powerful.
Caralee (21:42):
So there's lots of ways that we can make more profit, and I think for some of us, we have a bit of work to do around money mindset or asking for money, talking about fees and feeling like what we offer is worth what we are charging. There's definitely a lot of work around that that we all need to do and overcome because being a business owner, when you're working in a practise, it's easier because it's sort of like they set the rules, they set the fees, and that's just what it is. Whereas when it's us serving our own clients, sometimes different things creep in emotional responses to different clients or whatever it might be, but charging the right amount is a way of making a lot more profit. So one of the people in the scalable business lounge this year, as she's a estate planning lawyer, she just put her prices up.
(22:37):
That's one of the tactics or strategies that she used, and she's had the best year she's ever had and she's increased her revenue and her profit because she just did that one thing. But if you have a really solid data analysis in your firm and exactly where each of your money is coming from, what your average dollar spend is per client, those sorts of figures, you can really also make a lot of great decisions around marketing, around hiring. You can predict cashflow into the future. So having a good data strategy helps and something like charging the right amount and knowing your numbers, I think that a lot of people are just too scared to know their numbers properly and too scared to really charge what they should be charging. So I would definitely be looking at a resource like what Tara has put out with knowing what others are charging. Tell me about that resource.
Tara (23:39):
Yeah, so we've got our estate planning pricing toolkit, and it's nowhere near as in depth as what you offer in the scalable lounge, and it is just for estate planning lawyers, and half of it is about pricing. So we talk about pricing theory, like value pricing, fixed pricing. We actually talk about what you should be charging for your Testament tree trust will packages and compare what our TT precedent club members around the country are charging. To give you some idea and inspiration, we have priceless templates in terms of whether you're doing packages or a shopping list type or a cafe list type pricing, should you put your pricing on your website, all of that. And then the other part of it is protecting yourself in your cost agreement terms. So all of the particular things that can go haywire on an estate planning matter, clients putting paper clips on the front of the wheel, meaning it all needs to be resigned, who's responsible for attorneys signing their acceptances, clients wanting word copies so that they can just go rogue in their wheels. We just have all of that protected in your cost agreement terms. So you can just make sure that when this stuff comes up, you've got the confidence to say, oh look, it's not in our terms and condition. So it's a great resource, but I actually wanted to shout out the way that you approach data because I mean, it sounds like a snooze, but it is so powerful.
Caralee (25:12):
It's actually not a snooze. When you get into it, it actually becomes so much fun because you look at your data and honestly people getting started with it, they do sometimes struggle to get started, but once they get started and then they see the power that it has, like, oh, if I just pull the lever, if I just increase my fees by 10%, look what happens to my data. And so I provide all these incredible spreadsheets that you can basically plan out your whole year of what it might look like if you just charge this or charge A or B or what it looks like if you employed a senior associate versus a junior to help you with your service delivery. And then you can basically put it into the spreadsheet and you can see what the results are going to be. So you get this predictability rather than sort of guessing.
(26:07):
Because we don't want to run a business by guessing. We want to know what the data is. So I don't only do that say on financial data, but also in my firm, we measure about 15 points of data every single week. And it helps me massively not be present in the firm because I know exactly every single week how many inquiries we've had, how many of those inquiries have turned into initials, how many are paid, how many have retained, how much our advertising or marketing spend is. So that's sort of some marketing data. Then we'll look at productivity data so we can really look at who's done what and if their productivity is down, why. So we can investigate that kind of thing. And then of course, just the financial data, which we know about when we go to our accountant every year, but we need to be on top of that weekly so that we can be proactive rather than reactive. So setting up these data strategies is something that I help firms to do because it absolutely helps you to drive your firm in so many ways, but also with things like pricing as well.
Tara (27:19):
Oh, it's amazing. I feel like a lot of us running on a wish and a prayer and...
Caralee (27:28):
Most law firm, it's actually amazing. I talk to so many law firm owners and they just don't know their figures. That's actually quite normal. They don't know their data or their numbers, but honestly, if you implement these strategies, your business will fly ahead because you have actually got firm evidence of what is happening, and it's not a gut instinct on anything. And so things like, say back to pricing, if you've got a good data strategy, you can drive up your pricing and you then have data to know whether or not that has the increase of pricing has put people off or not. You've actually, you can see the data, you'll be able to see how many clients you're converting after you're talking about price versus beforehand, and then you can course correct if it doesn't work. So in my firm, we did something major this year as a change, which was the way we onboard clients.
(28:25):
And I know with estate planning lawyers, I've got, there's so many different strategies on how to get a client over the line in terms of conversion, but with us, what we were doing was a free initial appointment for an hour. And I know some of your clients do that too, Tara, which is great if you've got a very high conversion rate, but if your conversion rate is lower and you're still spending all of that time, is that a good way of spending time? And for me, I had a mindset that I wanted to, that was our sort of pro bono sending people in the right direction. But now we've set up a strategy where we do what we call a triage call. So it's a 15 minute call really to filter whether or not they're going to be a good client or not for us. And with that, I was scared that if we don't give them a whole hour, how are we going to convert them? But because we've got the data strategy in place, we can measure it. And what's actually it's turned out is that we are not giving away so much time or we're still converting just as much. So there's practises and things that you can change and implement without it being guesswork. And that's the main powerful thing from collecting your data and analysing it every week, is that then you don't have to guess anything.
Tara (29:42):
Just take that emotion of it and your personal fear and you don't have to have your limiting beliefs holding you back.
Caralee (29:52):
Yeah, that's right. We do. We make up stories or we have based on our own experiences or based on what we think our type of clients want. And I know with estate planning lawyers, there's so many different ways of successfully onboarding clients, but you want that to be not only successful, you also want it to be efficient and you want it to not be costing you heaps of time or money or energy to onboard. Nothing worse than spending all that time with someone and then they decide to not go ahead.
Tara (30:32):
You've been so generous with your time. There's one more thing I want to ask you about, and that's about you also work with firms who are larger who've been on this journey for a while and have a team. So how do you work with those types of firms?
Caralee (30:49):
So those types of firms? So in the scalable business lounges the first programme that's more about starting to grow a team, so getting that consistent workflow coming in. And the way in which we do that, the logistics of it is that it's an online step-by-step programme as well as group coaching with me online twice a month. And we're also going to be introducing a once a month tech where we talk about the latest tech and how you can really automate your firm as much as you possibly can. So that's the scalable business manager. There's lots of templates and all sorts of stuff in the accelerator programme with firms that are larger. Often it's the bit of chaos that's going on in the background where things just aren't running as smoothly as they would like. And even though they've got a team, the principal is still being pulled back into legal work, often supervising way too many people a bottleneck for a lot that's going on in the business.
(31:53):
So things just don't get done because people are waiting on them because they're tapped out with so much work on their plates. So with those people, what we do is we get this structure organised and look at this is what it looks like now. These are the seats in your firm. Do you have the right people in the right seats? And if we grow your firm out to be a $2 million, $3 million firm, what people are we going to need as we grow out? What seats do we need to create? And really also working out what tasks are the business is the business owner doing? Where's all your time being spent and how can we get those tasks off your plate? So that's kind of the first step that we do. And then my firm has been completely systemized from everything you do from onboarding a client to scripting sales calls to service delivery, to how you answer the phone, you name it, there's like 250 odd documents to run the firm basically for each seat in the business. And all of that has been templated out. So we implement the structure and strategy in other firms so that they can have their firm running like a well org machine. So it's a massively transformational kind of year or so that we spend together, and we just work through everything from management to data to marketing to operations, finance and service delivery of the firm. So yeah, you've got to be prepared to get in there and make it happen, but when people do, it's incredible what happens to their firm.
Tara (33:38):
Okay. Wow, I'm almost speechless. How wonderful that sounds. So we might wrap it up. Caralee, you've been so generous with letting us look under the hood in terms of the support that's available, and I just want to make it completely clear to everybody, I am not getting paid for this. There's no affiliate code or anything. I just am such a huge fan of what Caralee is doing at Scalable Law, and I have witnessed firsthand so many of our TT precedents club members go through and are still in the scalable law programmes and the transformation that they've had. And what I can see is that they are the ones doing the cutting edge stuff in estate planning because they've got the space and the mental bandwidth to be creative, to try out new things. And even Caralee in your programmes, I think you go through the entire customer journey and audit that and say, where can we do better? So that identifies how can we do estate planning better?
Caralee (34:51):
Yeah, that's right. And yeah, how can you be the best firm that you can be and how can this firm offer you as a business owner the best lifestyle that you want? I think we can start drowning, and I see it all the time on forums that I'm in and things like that where it's sort of like, I don't know if I should be in this firm. It's just such hard work and there are ways around it and out of it in terms of let's just get back to where you wanted the firm to be in the first place. I think we go along and we forget what those goals and dreams were because the mud gets so thick that you are right in it and you're just in this reactive survival mode, and we need to elevate out of that. And like you say, create space for yourself because being a business owner, you need to have space to be creative.
(35:44):
And I know that's a weird thought as lawyers, because we don't think of ourselves as creatives, but you've created a business and you've created it for a purpose. So let's start living that purpose out, which is the firm supplying you with a lifestyle and your family with a lifestyle that you want, and you're not in this business for the next 12 months. And I think when we first start a business, we don't think about it being like 20 years or 30 years, but you are potentially going to be in this business for the next 10, 20 years. So let's make it a great investment. Let's make it something amazing that you can exit and sell down track, and let's make it a firm that can give you the best lifestyle while you're in it as well. So yeah, it's really exciting the opportunities that I see that lots of law firm owners have and aren't tapping into yet.
Tara (36:41):
Yeah, I just love it, Caralee, and in this podcast, Carrie and I give a lot of unsolicited advice about what I'm like Write a newsletter. Oh yeah, start a pod, audit your customer journey, automate this, systemize that. And if you're listening going, I don't have time to even have a lunch break, I don't have time to do a week in between clients, I'm just maxed out, then I would really encourage you to reach out and connect with Caralee and her team because her programme at Scalable Law, it's the best thing that I've seen in the market in terms of being able to give you that space in your firm for you to experiment and try and implement these different things or even work out.
(37:33):
Is it good advice? Is Tara giving me good advice based on my data that is not going to actually be a good investment or turn the dial on anything? I just think it's such a tremendous support. I want you to know that there's a support and community available if you want to grow your firm and have your firm working from you, Caralee, you help business owners scale, but you also, you don't have to scale. If you just want to have a lifestyle law firm, that means you can go to your kids' swimming lessons and be there for the Sports carnival and just not stress about it. You help people achieve that too, right?
Caralee (38:16):
Yes. So it's scaling to whatever that means for you. And for me, that means away from me as much as possible so that I can spend my time helping other law firm owners. But for some career lawyers who have their own firms absolutely love service delivery and they love providing the estate plans and dealing with their favourite type of client. So it might be that you just want more of that favourite type of client and less of the tyre kicker types that you're getting. You might want your firm just to feel easier. You're quite happy with the profit, you're quite happy, but you just want it to not take as much time away from your family. So while others want to, I've got people in my programme that have 20 employees. So it depends what you want, whether you and we meet you where you want to go, it's about your goals and what you want out of it. This is your business that you've created to provide you with a lifestyle. So it's whatever you are dreaming of and we meet you there.
Tara (39:24):
If you really enjoyed listening to Caralee and I chat today, Caralee has her own podcast, the Scalable Law Podcast, and she's got way more episodes than we have. You've been doing it for a long time. So you can go and binge and listen to all of Caralee's advice over there. Caralee, you are also hosting Law Biz Con in May 2025 on the Gold Coast.
Caralee (39:49):
So Law Biz Con is a conference for law firm owners who want to grow and scale their firms. We basically run the same type of stuff that we do in Scalable Law, which is either about attracting clients, building a team, or automating your firm. So there's lots of streams to do with all of those types of things. It's two days of jam packed amazingness. The whole idea with the conference was that I wanted people to go away and feel really on fire for their business, super inspired to come away and to be able to implement this, that and the next thing. And I've heard from so many people who attended the last year's one, who have said, since I went to Law bs, op implemented A, B, C, D, and that was exactly what I wanted people to achieve or come away. So there are people that go to that that are scalable or clients, there are people that go to that who are not. You just need to be a law firm owner and someone who wants to connect with others and grow your business. So learn some strategies on the day. So that's the eighth and 9th of May next year we still have early bird tickets, and you can go over to lawbizcon.com.au.
Tara (41:03):
Caralee, honestly, it was the best law conference I've been to, and I mean the bar is kind of low because I usually go to estate planning conferences.
Caralee (41:17):
That's the thing. I was like, law conferences are so boring and you get some nice tidbits out of a lot of law conferences, but you kind of got to sift through. That was a great session. And then you've got to go to the most boring session like a snore. And I wanted this to be a absolutely inspirational two days, you're taking two days, maybe three days because you need to travel there away from your business, so you need to make it worthwhile and make it count. Tara also hosted an estate planning table, so everyone got together and yeah, it was really awesome, wasn't it?
Tara (41:58):
Yeah. And that sounded a bit like a backhanded compliment when I said the bar was low, but honestly, I felt like we were in a totally different industry, a marketing conference, all these industries that have these sexy conventions. I was like, it was just incredible. The calibre of the speakers, the vast array of topics on the programme, and just being in the room with so many go-getters and incredible law firm owners who are just across a range of industries. We got to hear how they were all doing really exciting, innovative things in their businesses. Like I bought my ticket to 2025 before the 2024 conference was even over. It was just a no brainer to come again. So come and check that out as well. And lastly, currently is your website the best way for people to get in touch with you?
Caralee (42:54):
Yeah, so scalablelaw.com is where you'll find me, and if you want to have a call with me, I'm available for a strategy call. So that's probably the best way to start engaging. Otherwise, if you're not quite there yet and you're not sure what that means to jump on a call with me, I have a podcast, Scalable Law, and also there's a book that you can download online. It's a full book where I give it away for free on the website, so you can go over there and download. That's called Seven Figure Law Firm.
Tara (43:27):
Thank you so much for joining us Caralee. Look, as I said, I just didn't want to gatekeep what Caralee is doing over at Scalable Law because it's just so impressive. I've been obviously a big fan of we're good friends and I've been watching the whole journey from the establishment of Scalable law, but I've been seeing TT Precedents Club members go through it, and I just think it is such a powerful investment in your firm and I just want estate planning lawyers to live their best lives.
Caralee (44:04):
Me too. I know as well.
Tara (44:05):
Yeah. I just want you to love being a lawyer. Make more money in your law firm than you did as an employee. How's that time freedom? Whether you put that into your family, into filling your own cup after burnout or just serving your clients even better. I just think this type of investment is the thing that's really going to help you get there, and it's the perfect time of year to start planning it out and thinking about it. So I'm hoping this episode gave you some food for thought and a nice introduction to Caralee. And that's pretty much all I wanted to share. So we've got the show notes with some details on how to get in touch with Caralee, and we're going to wrap it up there. We hope to see you on our next episode.
Caralee (44:51):
Thank you so much. That's been awesome to be on your podcast.
Tara (44:56):
Oh, thank you for fitting us in between your busy travel schedule. Bye.
